<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Hi All,

From uncomfortably cold Western Cape in South Africa.

We as some of you will know run an Oliomio 50 and press oil from olives that
come from the valley that we live in.

We bottle the oil in a dark green wine bottle (500 ml) and use a special
cork with metal disks in it to close it, and then add a heat shrunk capsule

One of our magazines recently carried an article saying that it is not a
good idea to use a cork to close an olive oil bottle.

Does any one know whether or not this is true and if so why?

Regards

Mike

Riebeeck Olive Boutique

South Africa
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Dear Mike,
It's better to avoid oil contact with cork especially if the quality of the
cork is mediocre. Oil can go bad, more than wine.
As far as I know in Italy we never use cork to close olive oil bottle.
Antonio
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>There may be other reasons, but I have experienced mould growth starting on
the cork of a partially used bottle of oil. Maybe the spores were on the
cork to start off with, but I suspect that they are from the atmosphere and
found their way into the bottle during use. The cork probably provides a
better foothold for such spores than the smooth walls of the bottle or for
that matter the synthetic surfaces on the underside of a screwcap. All just
my speculation.

Regards

Kurt Küpper


-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Meredith [mailto:mikemer@...]
Sent: Tuesday, 16 July 2002 01:59
To: OliveOil
Subject: [OliveOil] Corks in Olive Oil Bottles


Hi All,

From uncomfortably cold Western Cape in South Africa.

We as some of you will know run an Oliomio 50 and press oil from olives
that
come from the valley that we live in.

We bottle the oil in a dark green wine bottle (500 ml) and use a special
cork with metal disks in it to close it, and then add a heat shrunk
capsule

One of our magazines recently carried an article saying that it is not a
good idea to use a cork to close an olive oil bottle.

Does any one know whether or not this is true and if so why?

Regards

Mike

Riebeeck Olive Boutique

South Africa



Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT



**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com

POLL: http://www.my3q.com/home/napm/6634.phtml
**************************************************

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Mike,
Hi,

Michael Meredith wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> >From uncomfortably cold Western Cape in South Africa.
>
> One of our magazines recently carried an article saying that it is not a
> good idea to use a cork to close an olive oil bottle.
>
> Does any one know whether or not this is true and if so why?

Fact is that Olive OIl is not a preservative (and good EVOO shouldn't
have any added!!!) so there is always the potential for nasties to creep
in via the cork. Wine just goes to vinegar, which is still useful. OO
goes to "Off" OO for which there are no really valuable uses that I know
of unless you're a masochist and like making your own soaps. (Please
don't shoot me, it was a joke!)

>
>
> Regards
>
> Mike

Cheers
John Attwood
Tamworth
(Northern) NSW Au
(Where it hasn't rained properly for at least 6 months. Makes for good
oil yeilds!)

>
>
>
>
>
> POLL: http://www.my3q.com/home/napm/6634.phtml
> **************************************************
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Dear John,
Though I've been following the group for a couple of
months, this is my first contribution and may be is
the right point for me to get into the discussion, as
I have worked as the bottling manager for a wine
producer here in Turkey for years.

Do you believe any wine producer in the world would
insist to use corks granted that their product is
likely to be oxidized into vinegar and still be
useful?

Well I don't. The fact, as you all know is, in the
case of wine the cork provides good protection
provided that it remains moist (the bottle is kept
laid). And the same should be true for olive oil. The
only question might arise from the fact that olive oil
does not contain any water to keep the cork wet.

Still though, I think closing oil bottles with corks
should not be a that bad alternative as oil has a
shelf life of max. 2 years, due to other intrinsic
measures, which is quite short compared to aged wines.
And a period of 2 years might be short enough
(although critical) for the cork to retain its initial
moisture and thus the preserving capabilities.

Regards
Selcuk Gider (TR)

> Fact is that Olive OIl is not a preservative (and
> good EVOO shouldn't
> have any added!!!) so there is always the potential
> for nasties to creep
> in via the cork. Wine just goes to vinegar, which is
> still useful. OO
> goes to "Off" OO for which there are no really
> valuable uses that I know
> of unless you're a masochist and like making your
> own soaps. (Please
> don't shoot me, it was a joke!)
>
> Cheers
> John Attwood
> Tamworth
> (Northern) NSW Au
> (Where it hasn't rained properly for at least 6
> months. Makes for good
> oil yeilds!)


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes
http://autos.yahoo.com
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Selcuk,
Welcome, and feel free to "get in" anytime.

Selcuk Gider wrote:

> Dear John,
> Though I've been following the group for a couple of
> months, this is my first contribution and may be is
> the right point for me to get into the discussion, as
> I have worked as the bottling manager for a wine
> producer here in Turkey for years.
>
> Do you believe any wine producer in the world would
> insist to use corks granted that their product is
> likely to be oxidized into vinegar and still be
> useful?
>
> Well I don't. The fact, as you all know is, in the
> case of wine the cork provides good protection
> provided that it remains moist (the bottle is kept
> laid). And the same should be true for olive oil. The
> only question might arise from the fact that olive oil
> does not contain any water to keep the cork wet.

That, I think, might just be the most important point. The keeping of
the cork moist is to make surethat it swells against the neck of the
bottle. Oil might have the same effect, but most oil is not stored on
the side (as is wine).

> Still though, I think closing oil bottles with corks
> should not be a that bad alternative as oil has a
> shelf life of max. 2 years, due to other intrinsic
> measures, which is quite short compared to aged wines.
> And a period of 2 years might be short enough
> (although critical) for the cork to retain its initial
> moisture and thus the preserving capabilities.

I think that Peter had a point, though, when he mentioned "ordinary"
standard corks. We have had bottles supplied with corks which crumbled
as soon as they were handled. They would be useless for keeping anything
in! The corks were a "composite" made from crumbled cork particles. They
hadn't been compressed very well and the "glue" wasn't very good at
binding. We've chucked them out and are looking for alternatives.

>
>
> Regards
> Selcuk Gider (TR)

Again, welcome.

John Attwood
Tamworth
(Northern) NSW Au

>
>
> Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes
> http://autos.yahoo.com
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
<<a href="http://rd.yahoo.com/M=228862.2128520.3581629.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1707216973:HM/A=1155066/R=0/">http://rd.yahoo.com/M=228862.2128520...=1707216973:H\
M/A=1155066/R=0/</a>*http://adfarm.mediaplex.com/ad/ck/990-1736-1039-302>
>
>
>
> **************************************************
> Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
>
> POLL: http://www.my3q.com/home/napm/6634.phtml
> Results: http://www.my3q.com/view/viewSummary.phtml?questid=1855
> **************************************************
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
> <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Selcuk

The fact, as you all know is, in the case of wine the cork provides good
protection
provided that it remains moist (the bottle is kept laid).

In the wine industry the corks are pressure fitted. In common practice with
olive oil they are not. How many times have you had to get a cork screw out to
open a bottle of oil? Some do, the overwhelming majority do not. Typically,
the cork is a hand-pressure closure and, in most instances, a lessor grade cork
is used than the pressure corks. The latter have to stand up to greater force
of course.

I suppose we could look as pressure corking but that's yet another expense. Or
perhaps move over to plastic "corks". In either event, unless said cork is
pressure fitted then oxidisation will occur. Because the oil lacks wetness, as
you point out, the cork ultimately shrinks rather quickly and before the oil has
time to reach its "Best By" date. Pressure corking is also a detraction from
the consumers point of view. We expect the pleasant charade of opening a bottle
of good wine with a corkscrew but it doesn't gel with oil.

This is why we have gone to some lengths (and costs) this year to move toward a
tamper proof aluminium seal that has a built-in oil pourer. Just like the
supermarket ones. We have gone one further step however and added a shrink seal
over the top of same. Looks good.

We have inverted both the ordinarily cork sealed bottle and the new one to test
for leakages. The cork one leaked overnight, the new one hasn't after two
months. I guess the lesson is, if one does use cork make sure it is a pressure
fitted one and even then I am not so sure.

Regards
Peter Caird
www.victorianolivegroves.com
AUSTRALIA



---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free by AVG
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.373 / Virus Database: 208 - Release Date: 01-07-2002


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Peter Hi,

Your quite correct about having to use a pressure device to insert the cork,
we invested in one right at the beginning and we have yet to have a bottle
leak.

We've also never had a problem with mould on the cork, all our oil is stored
like wine on its side in racks and there are no leaks which I guess proves
your point again about pressure sealing.

We also have our corks specially treated as I said in my original email.

This consists of two metal disks that are inserted into the cork near each
end and they are also treated with a substance that is meant for corks used
in oil. They are then sterilized and seals in plastic packs.

We are also considering the use of another closure but have not yet finished
our investigations

Regards

Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: P Caird [mailto:caird@...]
Sent: 17 July 2002 13:09
To: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [OliveOil] Corks in Olive Oil Bottles


Selcuk

The fact, as you all know is, in the case of wine the cork provides good
protection
provided that it remains moist (the bottle is kept laid).

In the wine industry the corks are pressure fitted. In common practice
with olive oil they are not. How many times have you had to get a cork
screw out to open a bottle of oil? Some do, the overwhelming majority do
not. Typically, the cork is a hand-pressure closure and, in most instances,
a lessor grade cork is used than the pressure corks. The latter have to
stand up to greater force of course.

I suppose we could look as pressure corking but that's yet another
expense. Or perhaps move over to plastic "corks". In either event, unless
said cork is pressure fitted then oxidisation will occur. Because the oil
lacks wetness, as you point out, the cork ultimately shrinks rather quickly
and before the oil has time to reach its "Best By" date. Pressure corking
is also a detraction from the consumers point of view. We expect the
pleasant charade of opening a bottle of good wine with a corkscrew but it
doesn't gel with oil.

This is why we have gone to some lengths (and costs) this year to move
toward a tamper proof aluminium seal that has a built-in oil pourer. Just
like the supermarket ones. We have gone one further step however and added
a shrink seal over the top of same. Looks good.

We have inverted both the ordinarily cork sealed bottle and the new one to
test for leakages. The cork one leaked overnight, the new one hasn't after
two months. I guess the lesson is, if one does use cork make sure it is a
pressure fitted one and even then I am not so sure.

Regards
Peter Caird
www.victorianolivegroves.com
AUSTRALIA



---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free by AVG
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.373 / Virus Database: 208 - Release Date: 01-07-2002


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT



**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com

POLL: http://www.my3q.com/home/napm/6634.phtml
Results: http://www.my3q.com/view/viewSummary.phtml?questid=1855
**************************************************

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Hi Peter,

In the experiment you have made with cork versus cap
what type of cork did you use. was it something like
the plastic headed cork that is common for liquors.
and more important is the bottle neck. what type of
bottle did you test with.

Of course I accept the fact that alum cap is a better
alternative in terms of reliability but what bothers
me is that a natural product like olive oil would
better be presented in packaging as natural as
possible. And in that sense cork sounds better than a
metal-plastic combination.

regards
Selcuk Gider (TR)

--- P Caird <caird@...> wrote:
> Selcuk
>
> The fact, as you all know is, in the case of wine
> the cork provides good protection
> provided that it remains moist (the bottle is kept
> laid).
>
> In the wine industry the corks are pressure fitted.
> In common practice with olive oil they are not. How
> many times have you had to get a cork screw out to
> open a bottle of oil? Some do, the overwhelming
> majority do not. Typically, the cork is a
> hand-pressure closure and, in most instances, a
> lessor grade cork is used than the pressure corks.
> The latter have to stand up to greater force of
> course.
>
> I suppose we could look as pressure corking but
> that's yet another expense. Or perhaps move over to
> plastic "corks". In either event, unless said cork
> is pressure fitted then oxidisation will occur.
> Because the oil lacks wetness, as you point out, the
> cork ultimately shrinks rather quickly and before
> the oil has time to reach its "Best By" date.
> Pressure corking is also a detraction from the
> consumers point of view. We expect the pleasant
> charade of opening a bottle of good wine with a
> corkscrew but it doesn't gel with oil.
>
> This is why we have gone to some lengths (and costs)
> this year to move toward a tamper proof aluminium
> seal that has a built-in oil pourer. Just like the
> supermarket ones. We have gone one further step
> however and added a shrink seal over the top of
> same. Looks good.
>
> We have inverted both the ordinarily cork sealed
> bottle and the new one to test for leakages. The
> cork one leaked overnight, the new one hasn't after
> two months. I guess the lesson is, if one does use
> cork make sure it is a pressure fitted one and even
> then I am not so sure.
>
> Regards
> Peter Caird
> www.victorianolivegroves.com
> AUSTRALIA
>
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free by AVG
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system
> (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.373 / Virus Database: 208 - Release
> Date: 01-07-2002
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been
> removed]
>
>


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes
http://autos.yahoo.com
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Hi Mike,

I have not seen corks with metal disks before, and
would appreciate any extra info you could send. If you
have pictures etc. you can mail me directly at :
selcukgider@...

thanks in advance,
Regards
Selcuk Gider (TR)

--- Michael Meredith <mikemer@...> wrote:
> Peter Hi,
>
> Your quite correct about having to use a pressure
> device to insert the cork,
> we invested in one right at the beginning and we
> have yet to have a bottle
> leak.
>
> We've also never had a problem with mould on the
> cork, all our oil is stored
> like wine on its side in racks and there are no
> leaks which I guess proves
> your point again about pressure sealing.
>
> We also have our corks specially treated as I said
> in my original email.
>
> This consists of two metal disks that are inserted
> into the cork near each
> end and they are also treated with a substance that
> is meant for corks used
> in oil. They are then sterilized and seals in
> plastic packs.
>
> We are also considering the use of another closure
> but have not yet finished
> our investigations
>
> Regards
>
> Mike


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Autos - Get free new car price quotes
http://autos.yahoo.com
</pre>
</td></tr></table>