<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Dear Julie,

If you have in mind to produce high quality olive oil, you need by the
others to:

1) do an early harvest (when the fruit it is half green and half brown)
2) press at temperature below 25°C and within 24 our from the harvest

Well, in this case the oil will show a very low free acidity and peroxydes
content and also high concentrantion of polyphenols.

This oil need at least 2 months to depositate and it is also reccomended to
operate more than one decantation.

Alternatively, I suggest you to filter the oil in a stainless stell tank
containing cotton as filtering surface.

There is an other choice that is the use of forced filtration obtain by
pressure and paper filter. I suggest you to do not use this metod because
many substancies responsible for the oil's organoleptic features are stopped
by this method.


You also choose to produce unfiltering oil. It is now well known that the
unfiltered oil is organoleptically the best choice for the fresh use, but
the little particles of fruit may undergo during time to organic
decomposition whic in turn increase free acidity, peroxydes and so on.
Therefore the oil quality decrease.

I suggest to consume unfiltered oil within 8 moths from the production date.

This discussion it is supported by chemical and organoleptic oil analysis
which we have done many times.


Regards

Marco Bettini
Organic Farm Domenico Bettini
http://www.aziendabettini.com










-----Messaggio originale-----
Da: juliemlloyd [mailto:lloyd@...]
Inviato: lunedì 17 giugno 2002 15.14
A: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Oggetto: [OliveOil] Filtration of oil


I'm interested to hear any comments on treatment of oil after
pressing.
Do most of the members of this group filter their oil? If so, what
type of filters do you prefer? How long do you leave the oil to
settle?
As a novice to oil production, I would appreciate your opinions.

Julie Lloyd




*************************
Check our new sister forum at:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/OliveOil
**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
List owner: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
Statistics about Olive: http://sadoun.com/olive/Statistics.htm


Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>I would like only to invite people to some more prudence im making statements
about processing issues.
Domenico stated that one should process at 25 C. It is neither correct or wrong.

One should look at a few things:
- Some studies have shown that polyphenol levels are stable during the malaxing
process up to 31 - 32 C. For more infomation dig out the studies made by Prof
Amirante from University of Bari. So would it be neccessary to process at 25C
???
- The viscosity of the oil changes logarithmically with the temperature. So by
processing at 25C you will make things much more complicated if you use
centrifugal technology to extract your oil. So, would it be necessary to look
for troubles ?
- The result of such a low temperature will be a reduced capacity of the
equipment and / or more losses. This can be fine for organic processors in niche
market but is not necessarily the best for everybody. Lets not forget that the
popularity of olive oil has been developed thanks to massive plants of 2 - 6
tons/h, mainly in Spain. Not everybody can afford the super super oil of niche
markets.
- Malaxing issues are actually very complicated and should not be simplified too
much.
A malaxer is a heat exchanged and its design is the result of history, market
requirements and competition. It is in any case a very inefficient device from
engineering point of view.
The heating of the paste is obtained by contact with the wall temperature, right
? One could reach 25 C in a very short time using very high wall temperature
like 50 C. The results of this would be the local evaporation of aromatic
components. This allows you nevertheless to use smaller malaxers and have a
cheaper machine to sell (from equipment supplier point of view)
The better way to do it to have a wall temperature close to the desired paste
temperature. Usually a 5C temp. difference will do but it will depend a lot on
ambient temperature (or olive storage temp)
Beside that malaxing time can be of dramatic effect. Overmalaxing will be
detrimental to the total polyphenol level and will increase the extracted
chlorophyll amount. Many people confuse bitterness and quality and tend to
believe that the bitterness given by chlorophyl is a good attribute and buy such
oils. I have even heard some equipment supplier recommending to block partially
the defoliator to increase the amount of leaves going into the paste to give
that bitterness.
To come back to the wall temperature argument, having to malax with a low temp
difference requires longer malaxing time and increase the malaxer volume
requirement leading to price increase on the machinery. Can everybody afford it
?
In short malaxers and malaxing parameters are a compromise between many
manufacturing, user and olive fruit related aspects. The olive fruit aspects
being so geography specific any strong position should be avoided as there
nothing like absolute truth in olive related matters, there are only gray areas
some darkers than others....

Regards,
Dessss


----- Original Message -----
Wrom: CMHVIBGDADRZFSQHYUCDDJBLVLMHAALPTCXLYR
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 19:11:04 +0200
To: <OliveOil@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: R: [OliveOil] Filtration of oil


> Dear Julie,
>
> If you have in mind to produce high quality olive oil, you need by the
> others to:
>
> 1) do an early harvest (when the fruit it is half green and half brown)
> 2) press at temperature below 25°C and within 24 our from the harvest
>
> Well, in this case the oil will show a very low free acidity and peroxydes
> content and also high concentrantion of polyphenols.
>
> This oil need at least 2 months to depositate and it is also reccomended to
> operate more than one decantation.
>
> Alternatively, I suggest you to filter the oil in a stainless stell tank
> containing cotton as filtering surface.
>
> There is an other choice that is the use of forced filtration obtain by
> pressure and paper filter. I suggest you to do not use this metod because
> many substancies responsible for the oil's organoleptic features are stopped
> by this method.
>
>
> You also choose to produce unfiltering oil. It is now well known that the
> unfiltered oil is organoleptically the best choice for the fresh use, but
> the little particles of fruit may undergo during time to organic
> decomposition whic in turn increase free acidity, peroxydes and so on.
> Therefore the oil quality decrease.
>
> I suggest to consume unfiltered oil within 8 moths from the production date.
>
> This discussion it is supported by chemical and organoleptic oil analysis
> which we have done many times.
>
>
> Regards
>
> Marco Bettini
> Organic Farm Domenico Bettini
> http://www.aziendabettini.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Messaggio originale-----
> Da: juliemlloyd [mailto:lloyd@...]
> Inviato: lunedì 17 giugno 2002 15.14
> A: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
> Oggetto: [OliveOil] Filtration of oil
>
>
> I'm interested to hear any comments on treatment of oil after
> pressing.
> Do most of the members of this group filter their oil? If so, what
> type of filters do you prefer? How long do you leave the oil to
> settle?
> As a novice to oil production, I would appreciate your opinions.
>
> Julie Lloyd
>
>
>
>
> *************************
> Check our new sister forum at:
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/OliveOil
> **************************************************
> Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> List owner: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
> **************************************************
> Statistics about Olive: http://sadoun.com/olive/Statistics.htm
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>
> *************************
> Check our new sister forum at:
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/OliveOil
> **************************************************
> Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> List owner: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
> **************************************************
> Statistics about Olive: http://sadoun.com/olive/Statistics.htm
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>


--
_______________________________________________
Download the free Opera browser at http://www.opera.com/

Free OperaMail at http://www.operamail.com/

Powered by Outblaze
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>I would like only to invite people to some more prudence im making statements
about processing issues.
Domenico stated that one should process at 25 C. It is neither correct or wrong.

One should look at a few things:
- Some studies have shown that polyphenol levels are stable during the malaxing
process up to 31 - 32 C. For more infomation dig out the studies made by Prof
Amirante from University of Bari. So would it be neccessary to process at 25C
???
- The viscosity of the oil changes logarithmically with the temperature. So by
processing at 25C you will make things much more complicated if you use
centrifugal technology to extract your oil. So, would it be necessary to look
for troubles ?
- The result of such a low temperature will be a reduced capacity of the
equipment and / or more losses. This can be fine for organic processors in niche
market but is not necessarily the best for everybody. Lets not forget that the
popularity of olive oil has been developed thanks to massive plants of 2 - 6
tons/h, mainly in Spain. Not everybody can afford the super super oil of niche
markets.
- Malaxing issues are actually very complicated and should not be simplified too
much.
A malaxer is a heat exchanged and its design is the result of history, market
requirements and competition. It is in any case a very inefficient device from
engineering point of view.
The heating of the paste is obtained by contact with the wall temperature, right
? One could reach 25 C in a very short time using very high wall temperature
like 50 C. The results of this would be the local evaporation of aromatic
components. This allows you nevertheless to use smaller malaxers and have a
cheaper machine to sell (from equipment supplier point of view)
The better way to do it to have a wall temperature close to the desired paste
temperature. Usually a 5C temp. difference will do but it will depend a lot on
ambient temperature (or olive storage temp)
Beside that malaxing time can be of dramatic effect. Overmalaxing will be
detrimental to the total polyphenol level and will increase the extracted
chlorophyll amount. Many people confuse bitterness and quality and tend to
believe that the bitterness given by chlorophyl is a good attribute and buy such
oils. I have even heard some equipment supplier recommending to block partially
the defoliator to increase the amount of leaves going into the paste to give
that bitterness.
To come back to the wall temperature argument, having to malax with a low temp
difference requires longer malaxing time and increase the malaxer volume
requirement leading to price increase on the machinery. Can everybody afford it
?
In short malaxers and malaxing parameters are a compromise between many
manufacturing, user and olive fruit related aspects. The olive fruit aspects
being so geography specific any strong position should be avoided as there
nothing like absolute truth in olive related matters, there are only gray areas
some darkers than others....

Regards,
Dessss


----- Original Message -----
Wrom: ADRZFSQHYUCDDJBLVLMHAALPTCXLYRWTQTIPWI
Date: Wed, 19 Jun 2002 19:11:04 +0200
To: <OliveOil@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: R: [OliveOil] Filtration of oil


> Dear Julie,
>
> If you have in mind to produce high quality olive oil, you need by the
> others to:
>
> 1) do an early harvest (when the fruit it is half green and half brown)
> 2) press at temperature below 25°C and within 24 our from the harvest
>
> Well, in this case the oil will show a very low free acidity and peroxydes
> content and also high concentrantion of polyphenols.
>
> This oil need at least 2 months to depositate and it is also reccomended to
> operate more than one decantation.
>
> Alternatively, I suggest you to filter the oil in a stainless stell tank
> containing cotton as filtering surface.
>
> There is an other choice that is the use of forced filtration obtain by
> pressure and paper filter. I suggest you to do not use this metod because
> many substancies responsible for the oil's organoleptic features are stopped
> by this method.
>
>
> You also choose to produce unfiltering oil. It is now well known that the
> unfiltered oil is organoleptically the best choice for the fresh use, but
> the little particles of fruit may undergo during time to organic
> decomposition whic in turn increase free acidity, peroxydes and so on.
> Therefore the oil quality decrease.
>
> I suggest to consume unfiltered oil within 8 moths from the production date.
>
> This discussion it is supported by chemical and organoleptic oil analysis
> which we have done many times.
>
>
> Regards
>
> Marco Bettini
> Organic Farm Domenico Bettini
> http://www.aziendabettini.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Messaggio originale-----
> Da: juliemlloyd [mailto:lloyd@...]
> Inviato: lunedì 17 giugno 2002 15.14
> A: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
> Oggetto: [OliveOil] Filtration of oil
>
>
> I'm interested to hear any comments on treatment of oil after
> pressing.
> Do most of the members of this group filter their oil? If so, what
> type of filters do you prefer? How long do you leave the oil to
> settle?
> As a novice to oil production, I would appreciate your opinions.
>
> Julie Lloyd
>
>
>
>
> *************************
> Check our new sister forum at:
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/OliveOil
> **************************************************
> Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> List owner: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
> **************************************************
> Statistics about Olive: http://sadoun.com/olive/Statistics.htm
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>
> *************************
> Check our new sister forum at:
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/OliveOil
> **************************************************
> Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
> Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
> Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> List owner: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
> **************************************************
> Statistics about Olive: http://sadoun.com/olive/Statistics.htm
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>


--
_______________________________________________
Download the free Opera browser at http://www.opera.com/

Free OperaMail at http://www.operamail.com/

Powered by Outblaze
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>dess ss wrote:

> I would like only to invite people to some more prudence im making statements
about processing issues.
> Domenico stated that one should process at 25 C. It is neither correct or
wrong.
>
> One should look at a few things:
> - Some studies have shown that polyphenol levels are stable during the
malaxing process up to 31 - 32 C. For more infomation dig out the studies made
by Prof Amirante from University of Bari. So would it be neccessary to process
at 25C ???
> - The viscosity of the oil changes logarithmically with the temperature. So by
processing at 25C you will make things much more complicated if you use
centrifugal technology to extract your oil. So, would it be necessary to look
for troubles ?
> - The result of such a low temperature will be a reduced capacity of the
equipment and / or more losses. This can be fine for organic processors in niche
market but is not necessarily the best for everybody. Lets not forget that the
popularity of olive oil has been developed thanks to massive plants of 2 - 6
tons/h, mainly in Spain. Not everybody can afford the super super oil of niche
markets.

RE: Centrifugal Technology

The "wetness" of water is significant. Surface tension of water determines alot,
depending on what you desire the outcome to be. There are certain surfactants
on the market that greatly enhance the quality of water in these regards. Most
are not compatible with food processing. The "wetter" the water is, meaning
less surface tension, the better it works in breaking down elements into much
smaller particles, and this is significant in the ability of a centrifuge to
perform
its best. Other factors in considering food-grade surfactants is pH. I know of
one food grade surfactant that has a pH of 8.2, and this would greatly effect
the acidity of olive oil. Another feature of this surfactant is that it reduces
or
eliminates centrifuge waste water's rancidity, thus making the waste water
into an environmental friendly water. Some have reported that water treated
with this surfactant provides an excellent fertilizer source,and they also
report
not needing fertilizers and extra water in drought conditions. The surfactant
also contains high-quality calcium, magnesium and potassium. The surfactant
has also been noted to reduce pest damage and kill unwanted bacteria, mold,
fungus, viral and spore microbes. Others report substantial increases in the
crop production and quality.

If you are interested in learning more, please email amiracleforyou@....
The product is in 29 countries and the 50 US states. The US government has
attempted to "back engineer" the product [though not food grade] and is using
it in foaming agents in anti-biological warfare. Research is ongoing and many
testimonies come in daily [and have been for 20 years]. Therefore, if you have
to have a lot of double-blind studies and tons of research to prove what I'm
telling you, realize that there is not a lot available. People love it because
it
works wonders, and that is why it is sold all over the world.

Am I trying to make a sales pitch? Not necessarily. My friend, John Mousourakis
has asked me to make this known to olive oil producers because he has told me
about the waste water causing problems in the environment. I endeavor to do
what I can to help others do a "clean job" to help keep this planet clean. This
surfactant does it better than anything I've ever seen. We are using it to clean
the rivers and streams in America, and for many other things, as it utility and
uses
seems to be limitless. Now you can be a hard-core skeptic and thumb your
nose at this if you desire, millions of others will still continue to be blessed
by its
miraculous results. Some have "talked" about using this product, and some "see"
what the resutls are without a lot of "talk". Its not an expensive product, but
if
it had been sold by the manufacturer to the "greedy" that offered 4.5 billion
dollars
[US] for the formula, you can be sure that the price would be sky-high by now.
This is a mission effort, sometimes the sick have been given this product at no
charge and have been healed of terminal illness. Its not about the money. Its
about quality. Only the olive oil producer that wants the best and most
effecient
products that can be used in olive oil production, and those who help prevent
trashing the environment enquire about this product, and unfortunately, that
number has been very few. Bottom line: If you want better olive oil and better
results with centrifuge extraction [and maybe be the one to discover a new olive
oil & water product], I'll expect to hear from you.

Scientific Report

Best Wishes,
Elder
</pre>
</td></tr></table>