<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Dear all

I agree with Brian re the high extraction temperatures - high temps also
tend to produce bitter oils and also burnt wood (stone=wood). A recent
discussion with Shimon Lavee and an Israeli olive grower in Australia (I
was also sitting in the car) centered around the Barnea Olive oil as a
mild oil.

Regarding table olives vs oil. Some countries have olives served up at
all meals not the occasional pizza or martini and so the reject olioves
do finish up in the oil line. However when olive oil prices are high
then the balance changes creating a relative deficiencey of table
olives.

According to the IOOC data - world table olives are in balance ie
production = consumption with the reserves, required to keep the retail
market steady, falling.

Regarding consumption - the Palestinians eat a lot of table olives. I
met an olive trader in Greece a couple of years ago and I asked him
about the Palestinians eating unprocessed olives for breakfast (cf
Bible) he said that the olives that have been attacked by olive fly lose
all their bitterness.

Stan Kailis
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>The processing temperature of 33 for Barnea seems very high to me also
and the extra 20 minute stirring. How much stirring is that in total?
The high temperature and extra stirring may help extract more oil but
would do nothing for the polyphenols.

Italians I have talked to who have been to Israel say that most of the
olive oil there is made from reject table olives and the market is
therefore used to bland oils. Is that a fair comment? I suppose few
Israelis have a Mediterranean tradition of olive oil consumption being
from northern regions where olives do not grow.


Cheers Brian Chatterton.
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>--- In OliveOil@egroups.com, "Nepean Bay Getaway" <getaway@s...> wrote:
> To the egroup
>
> I am wondering if any of you have heard bad or good things about the
Barnea
> olive tree. I am currently trying to promote the Barnea tree for
Agrolive
> and would like to hear your thoughts.
>
> Tracy

Tracey,
Call me old-fashioned, if you wish, BUT ...

Your job is to promote the cultivar? If this is so, then is it not
your place to be putting all the positive aspects of the cv rather
than asking the membership of this list to gather the info for you and
give it (free of charge) to you for our commercial advantage.

Surely, if Agrolive want you to promote the cv, they have given you a
list of growers supplied, and a sheaf of "bumph" which they want
distributed. Why should growers tell you of their woes and joys?
Shouldn't YOU be telling US all about the benefits of growing the cv?

John Attwood
Tamworth NSW Australia
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Thanks John

I am actually more interested to hear feedback. Don't you think that it is
important for any company to do a little market research.

I only asked a question and have had some good and bad responses, that's
what I am after, I haven't pressured anyone into giving me the information,
if you don't want to give information don't but if you do then that's great.

Tracy

-----Original Message-----
From: johnat@oxleyolives.au2.com [mailto:johnat@oxleyolives.au2.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 2:28 PM
To: OliveOil@egroups.com
Subject: [OliveOil] Barnea


--- In OliveOil@egroups.com, "Nepean Bay Getaway" <getaway@s...> wrote:
> To the egroup
>
> I am wondering if any of you have heard bad or good things about the
Barnea
> olive tree. I am currently trying to promote the Barnea tree for
Agrolive
> and would like to hear your thoughts.
>
> Tracy

Tracey,
Call me old-fashioned, if you wish, BUT ...

Your job is to promote the cultivar? If this is so, then is it not
your place to be putting all the positive aspects of the cv rather
than asking the membership of this list to gather the info for you and
give it (free of charge) to you for our commercial advantage.

Surely, if Agrolive want you to promote the cv, they have given you a
list of growers supplied, and a sheaf of "bumph" which they want
distributed. Why should growers tell you of their woes and joys?
Shouldn't YOU be telling US all about the benefits of growing the cv?

John Attwood
Tamworth NSW Australia


************************************************** ***
BOOKS ON OLIVE: http://sadoun.com/olive.htm
************************************************** ***
Addresses:
Post message: OliveOil@egroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@egroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@egroups.com
List owner: OliveOil-owner@egroups.com
URL to this page: http://www.egroups.com/group/OliveOil
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>To Brian Chatterton
I have just now seen your remarks on the Barnea, have not read you
book, but according to my experience the tipical taste of this brand
(picking it black) is very green cut grass lovely flavor, sweet on
the palat and rough pungent in the throut and the back of the mouth.
Some time the oil is very bitter and it is a problem we do not know
how to heandle. If you heat it obove 25 it will get very easy the
fusty tatste.

David Eitam
More Netofa
Israel
--- In OliveOil@y..., Brian Chatterton <tn7685@o...> wrote:
> Tracey,
>
> You have no doubt read the few pages in our book "Discovering
oil"
> devoted to Barnea. Since then I have tasted more NZ Barnea and have
> found that some growers are getting round the "bland Barnea"
problem
> through extremely early picking. It certainly works. The oil has a
bite.
> The problem is lack of balance. Some one in this group descibed
severe
> burns (or at least the sensation) to the back of the throat after
> tasting an oil. That is an exaggeration but without fruit to
carry it
> on the palate bitterness alone is not pleasant.
>
> Why are Australians and New Zealanders so interested in such an
obscure
> variety?
>
> Quality is important but also perceptions of quality. Take a leaf
out
> of the wine industry book. There are plenty of excellent wine
grapes
> that are not the French (mostly) famous dozen but Australia and NZ
are
> not major players in the world wine scene and are not going to
convince
> the world of the merits of excellent but obscure varieties.
>
> Would it not be simpler to plant olive oil varieties with a proven
track
> record of quality rather than obscure varieties from Israel,
California
> and Ozzie ones that have lost their pedigree?
>
>
> Cheers Brian Chatterton
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Re: Barnea, Our Barnea seems to do pretty well. We try to pick the olives
black, and let them stay in the mixing trough for an extra 20 minutes
getting the paste up to about 33 degrees. The oil came out light brown
almost white and within a week or two gave a
beautiful golden yellow color. The taste and smell are quite good. While I
may agree that it lacks enough balance, when consumed with all types of
food people are very satisfied. Since Barnea has a naturally low acidity
level, the extra mixing and heat do not affect the quality.
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>David

"Since Barnea has a naturally low acidity level, the extra mixing and heat
do not affect the quality."

I would have thought that the heating (to 33C) would have affected the
polyphenols. Have you tested for same? It would be good to see a chemical
analysis of unheated vs heated or just the latter if you have it and could
post same. Did you do a rancimat test?

Regards
Peter Caird
www.victorianolivegroves.com
0418 392 157
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Well I have finally has a taste of fresh Barnea oil pressed yesterday &
settled overnight. The oil was not bland but compared to, say Frantoio, it
lacked depth and character. The nose was a delight with a fresh "green
grass" aroma which did not develop on the palate. There was none of the
typical back palate pepper associated with the more bolder varieties while
front and middle palates illustrated a "buttery" taste without greasiness.
Yield was a disappointing 13% wxw altho I have heard reports from as little
as 6% up to 22%. In my mind it w/could be a very useful blender/filler or a
straight out success in it's own right in markets not wanting the strident
flavours of Australia/Tuscany.

Ken McDougal (of Timbercor) pointed out to me today that Barnea have a very
strict irrigation regime that should be adhered to which includes watering
right up to harvest. From memory I think the rate is (for 2 year old trees)
18L/week - modified according to what God gives us.

This of course flies in the face of what other varieties respond to. Feed a
depleted M (or other) and they will plump up beautifully but not produce any
more oil.

Can other processors of Barnea give a call on yields for Barnea in Oz?

Any one final plea to Marco. Where are you my friend? It has been so long
since we have heard from you. But thanks to
Mohamed El-Kholy whom I thought had dropped off the planet. Please do not
let this forum become just an Oz/NZ thing as we all appreciate the efforts
you have made in the past. Your contributions have been invaluable and your
friendliness transgresses all governmental/parochial boundaries.

Regards
Peter Caird
www.victorianolivegroves.com
0418 392 157
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>P Caird wrote:

> -------------snip---------------snip-----------------
>
> Any one final plea to Marco. Where are you my friend? It has been so long
> since we have heard from you. But thanks to
> Mohamed El-Kholy whom I thought had dropped off the planet.

Oh, NO!! He was alive and well just a short time ago. All enjoyed his
grove tour and lecture at Inverell.

> Please do not
> let this forum become just an Oz/NZ thing as we all appreciate the efforts
> you have made in the past. Your contributions have been invaluable and your
> friendliness transgresses all governmental/parochial boundaries.

Hear! Hear! That goes for the other international contributors also,
just remember to tell us where you are from, please.

John Attwood
Tamworth
(Northern) NSW Au

www.oxleyolives.au2.com
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Recent ASIC publications give a negative impression about the quality of
the Barnea Extra Virgin Olive Oil. Personally we tasted this oil and were
amazed about the good quality. We thought it is an excellent oil to export
to countries (like Asia, Northern Europe, the USA for example)where olive
oil is not daily used yet like in Italy or Spain.

Regards

Michel
</pre>
</td></tr></table>