<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Dear all,

Does anybody have any experience - good or bad - in using pre-emergent
herbicides with olive trees? I am interested in being able to inhibit the
growth of weeds rather than having to keep knocking them down with
herbicides, but I understand that pre-emergents work on the soil and with
the surface rooted olives I am wary of damaging the trees.

Regards,

Mike Wilson
Hunter Valley.
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Hello
I have had reasonable experience with pre-emergent herbicides and we
have commonly used Stomp/Rifle (Pendamethalin) or simazine(depending on
soil texture.)
Atrazine Amitrole, the old form of Bantox AA was also tried with very
poor results. I wouldn't recommend it on young trees.
Stomp has the best results even at rates as low as 6 litres per hectare.
Simazine has some soil movement and did cause some damage on lighter
soils but was much more price efficient.
A couple of growers had disastrous results using metsulfuron-methyl
(esteem, brush-off) because they didn't read the label. Assuming it had
soil residual properties against hardy weeds they applied it at above
label rates not knowing it would actually harm there trees even at rates
of 5 grams per hectare. Woops!
I would never recommend that pre-emergent herbicides are used unless all
other options have been assessed.
Olives have very shallow feeder roots and you can cut them, rip them etc
and the tree still performs with very few adverse symptoms. These same
feeder roots are in the zone that the herbicides are most effective and
uptake in olives is much more likely than other crops such as vines.
Adverse symptoms we have seen tend to be towards stunting and chlorosis
of younger leaves.
I run cows under my mature trees until preflowering and then into the
good old slashing. I'll only use a knockdown herbicide a few months
before harvest if I need to. Our summer tends to control weeds before
harvest.

There are a number of different brands of under row mechanical weeders
on the market, we have the Pellenc Tournesol. This is marketed at the
viticultural industry but has been adapted into other different
horticultural enterprises.

Russell March B.Ag.Sc.
Technical Sales Advisor
Pellenc Australia
Telephone: 61 8333 1177
Fax: 61 8333 1166
Mobile: 0418 825 812
-----Original Message-----
From: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OliveOil@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Mike Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, 9 August 2005 8:55 AM
To: Olives Groups
Subject: [OliveOil] Pre-emergent herbicides

Dear all,

Does anybody have any experience - good or bad - in using pre-emergent
herbicides with olive trees? I am interested in being able to inhibit
the
growth of weeds rather than having to keep knocking them down with
herbicides, but I understand that pre-emergents work on the soil and
with
the surface rooted olives I am wary of damaging the trees.

Regards,

Mike Wilson
Hunter Valley.






**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
SPONSOR: http://www.sadoun.com



________________________________

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS

* Visit your group "OliveOil
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OliveOil> " on the web.

* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>

* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service <http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .

________________________________



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Hello,

I fail to understand why it is that the 'weeds' have to be poisoned in the
first place. They are only there to help cover and hold the soil in place.

To control and manage the under-story vegetation on established trees,
consider grazing with sheep or geese or if you must burn fossil fuels, slash
the inter-row and use this material as a mulch around the trees to suppress
the weeds. It is much healthier for the soil, the trees and you (and your
bank balance!)

Best regards,

Gerhard Grasser

(Hon) Secretary, Organic Federation of Australia
Chair, Traders & Intermedaries Advisory Board, OFA www.ofa.org.au

IF you have even the slightest interest in sustainable or organic
agriculture & food, visit www.ifoam2005.info for more details about the
international event coming to Australia in September 2005........

AgriSolutions Pty Ltd

PO Box 81
Darnum VIC 3822

Phone 03 5627 8663
Fax 03 5627 8663 (by arrangement)
Mobile 0402 213 736
Email seagrow@...

***Natural farming advisory service
***Soil fertility specialists - Albrecht & Mikhail principles
***Independent soil, water and foliage testing
***Kelp, seaweeds and fish for soil, plants and animals
***Mineral fertilisers and stock supplements
***Natural farm inputs - hydrogen peroxide, trace elements, humates,
biologicals, organic fertilisers
***Fodder & pasture seeds

"A man should farm as if he would live 1,000 years, but live as though he
were to die tomorrow."


-----Original Message-----
From: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OliveOil@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Mike Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, 9 August 2005 9:25 AM
To: Olives Groups
Subject: [OliveOil] Pre-emergent herbicides

Dear all,

Does anybody have any experience - good or bad - in using pre-emergent
herbicides with olive trees? I am interested in being able to inhibit the
growth of weeds rather than having to keep knocking them down with
herbicides, but I understand that pre-emergents work on the soil and with
the surface rooted olives I am wary of damaging the trees.

Regards,

Mike Wilson
Hunter Valley.







**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
SPONSOR: http://www.sadoun.com
Yahoo! Groups Links
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>> Hello,
>
> I fail to understand why it is that the 'weeds' have to be poisoned in the
> first place. They are only there to help cover and hold the soil in place.

We are just exploring options here. In this particular grove the soil is
extremely heavy clay so in order to grow trres we have worked up the soil
with lime and organic material, then formed the soil up into raised beds and
planted on the beds. This means that when we get our customery heavy dumps
of rain the trees won't become waterlogged. We grow a ceral crop in the
inter-row, slash this and throw it under the tree rows as mulch (all good
organic stuff so far!)

The short term problem that we face is the soil that is ideal for olives is
also ideal for a whole host of other plants, and they pose a threat to the
young trees. Currently we knock the weeds down with a knock-down herbicide
(sorry Gerhard) and leave the dead weeds as extra mulch and food for the
worms. Our local contractor also does grapevines and suggested we look at a
pre-emergent herbicide to make life easier. We have looked into it and
decided against it.

>
> To control and manage the under-story vegetation on established trees,
> consider grazing with sheep or geese or if you must burn fossil fuels,
slash
> the inter-row and use this material as a mulch around the trees to
suppress
> the weeds. It is much healthier for the soil, the trees and you (and your
> bank balance!)
>

This may be an option once the trees are established, but the mounded beds
raise a few problems of their own. Mowing isn't an option on the steeper
slopes. We will be looking at steam to control weeds once the trees get
established, but are tentative as we expect to damage the irrigation.
Alpacas look interesting as a grazing animal.

Regards, and thanks for the input.

Mike Wilson.
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Hello,

In Turkey, sheep grazing in olive orchards is prevented by law, due to the
damage to the trees by the sheep--they prefer the olive leaves to the grass....

Regards,

Isin Ozgen
Erdek, Turkey

AgriSolutions <seagrow@...> wrote:
Hello,

I fail to understand why it is that the 'weeds' have to be poisoned in the
first place. They are only there to help cover and hold the soil in place.

To control and manage the under-story vegetation on established trees,
consider grazing with sheep or geese or if you must burn fossil fuels, slash
the inter-row and use this material as a mulch around the trees to suppress
the weeds. It is much healthier for the soil, the trees and you (and your
bank balance!)

Best regards,

Gerhard Grasser

(Hon) Secretary, Organic Federation of Australia
Chair, Traders & Intermedaries Advisory Board, OFA www.ofa.org.au

IF you have even the slightest interest in sustainable or organic
agriculture & food, visit www.ifoam2005.info for more details about the
international event coming to Australia in September 2005........

AgriSolutions Pty Ltd

PO Box 81
Darnum VIC 3822

Phone 03 5627 8663
Fax 03 5627 8663 (by arrangement)
Mobile 0402 213 736
Email seagrow@...

***Natural farming advisory service
***Soil fertility specialists - Albrecht & Mikhail principles
***Independent soil, water and foliage testing
***Kelp, seaweeds and fish for soil, plants and animals
***Mineral fertilisers and stock supplements
***Natural farm inputs - hydrogen peroxide, trace elements, humates,
biologicals, organic fertilisers
***Fodder & pasture seeds

"A man should farm as if he would live 1,000 years, but live as though he
were to die tomorrow."


-----Original Message-----
From: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OliveOil@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Mike Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, 9 August 2005 9:25 AM
To: Olives Groups
Subject: [OliveOil] Pre-emergent herbicides

Dear all,

Does anybody have any experience - good or bad - in using pre-emergent
herbicides with olive trees? I am interested in being able to inhibit the
growth of weeds rather than having to keep knocking them down with
herbicides, but I understand that pre-emergents work on the soil and with
the surface rooted olives I am wary of damaging the trees.

Regards,

Mike Wilson
Hunter Valley.







**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
SPONSOR: http://www.sadoun.com
Yahoo! Groups Links












**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
SPONSOR: http://www.sadoun.com



SPONSORED LINKS
Small business finance Business finance schools Olive oil health

---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


Visit your group "OliveOil" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


---------------------------------



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>

<table border=0 cellpadding=2 cellspacing="0"><tr><td>
<pre>Isin,

I don't know if it's legally permitted or not but in Southwestern Turkey, they
graze cows in olive orchards. But taking a prevention, they tie the neck of the
cow to one of its forelegs so that the cow only eat the grass not olive leaves.
(Maybe this is also contrary to Animal Rights.)

Regards.

Ozgen Gulmen
Bafa Tarim Ltd.
Turkey

-----Original Message-----
From: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OliveOil@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of
isin ozgen
Sent: Tuesday, August 16, 2005 3:14 PM
To: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [OliveOil] Pre-emergent herbicides


Hello,

In Turkey, sheep grazing in olive orchards is prevented by law, due to the
damage to the trees by the sheep--they prefer the olive leaves to the grass....

Regards,

Isin Ozgen
Erdek, Turkey

AgriSolutions <seagrow@...> wrote:
Hello,

I fail to understand why it is that the 'weeds' have to be poisoned in the
first place. They are only there to help cover and hold the soil in place.

To control and manage the under-story vegetation on established trees,
consider grazing with sheep or geese or if you must burn fossil fuels, slash
the inter-row and use this material as a mulch around the trees to suppress
the weeds. It is much healthier for the soil, the trees and you (and your
bank balance!)

Best regards,

Gerhard Grasser

(Hon) Secretary, Organic Federation of Australia
Chair, Traders & Intermedaries Advisory Board, OFA www.ofa.org.au

IF you have even the slightest interest in sustainable or organic
agriculture & food, visit www.ifoam2005.info for more details about the
international event coming to Australia in September 2005........

AgriSolutions Pty Ltd

PO Box 81
Darnum VIC 3822

Phone 03 5627 8663
Fax 03 5627 8663 (by arrangement)
Mobile 0402 213 736
Email seagrow@...

***Natural farming advisory service
***Soil fertility specialists - Albrecht & Mikhail principles
***Independent soil, water and foliage testing
***Kelp, seaweeds and fish for soil, plants and animals
***Mineral fertilisers and stock supplements
***Natural farm inputs - hydrogen peroxide, trace elements, humates,
biologicals, organic fertilisers
***Fodder & pasture seeds

"A man should farm as if he would live 1,000 years, but live as though he
were to die tomorrow."


-----Original Message-----
From: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com [mailto:OliveOil@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Mike Wilson
Sent: Tuesday, 9 August 2005 9:25 AM
To: Olives Groups
Subject: [OliveOil] Pre-emergent herbicides

Dear all,

Does anybody have any experience - good or bad - in using pre-emergent
herbicides with olive trees? I am interested in being able to inhibit the
growth of weeds rather than having to keep knocking them down with
herbicides, but I understand that pre-emergents work on the soil and with
the surface rooted olives I am wary of damaging the trees.

Regards,

Mike Wilson
Hunter Valley.







**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
SPONSOR: http://www.sadoun.com
Yahoo! Groups Links












**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
SPONSOR: http://www.sadoun.com



SPONSORED LINKS
Small business finance Business finance schools Olive oil health

---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS


Visit your group "OliveOil" on the web.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.


---------------------------------



__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





**************************************************
Post message: OliveOil@yahoogroups.com
Subscribe: OliveOil-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
Unsubscribe: OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Moderators: OliveOil-owner@yahoogroups.com
**************************************************
SPONSOR: http://www.sadoun.com



_____

YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS



* Visit your group " OliveOil <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/OliveOil> " on the
web.


* To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
<mailto:OliveOil-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com?subject=Unsubscribe>


* Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service
<http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/> .


_____




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
</pre>
</td></tr></table>